Food

[Henry Krinkle]

I made baguettes the other day from a poolish... and in fact I froze two from that batch and baked them about an hour ago for turkey meatball subs.

I have a question, Henry... my baguettes and boule breads come out nice looking, and the crumb is good, flavor is good, but the crust is just so darn crusty that it's hard to eat the bread or even cut it. Do you have any tips to tame that? Am I over baking at too low of temp? Doing something wrong with my dough?

I'm at a loss, and it seems consistent no matter what I bake, baguettes, boule, bagels, etc.

Tough crusts can be an issue with sourdoughs. Maybe try something slightly fresher like your poolish or a biga plus the addition of a cup of dough reserved from a loaf you baked about a week ago. Have you done any old dough yet?


Oven temp can be a really big thing. I would get an accurate oven thermometer and find out what your oven's true temperature is. +-25 degrees is kind of the norm and it is not unheard of for ovens to be 50 degrees out.

Do you measure by weight or by volume. Flour is highly hygroscopic, so a change in humidity can give you wildy different results if you are measuring by volume. If you are close to the ocean or in a very humid area most recipes aren't designed for you. I have the opposite problem. I live in an extremely dry area and in winter measuring by weight can yield me a full cup less of flour than it does in summer.

Do you use any of the steam oven techniques? Ice cubes, spraying the oven, baking in a Dutch oven? My preferred method is a baking stone, I use a big heavy Pflatzgraff that we bought in the mid 90s, and a giant stainless steel bowl. The circumference of the bowl needs to be smaller than the circumference of the stone but big enough to not interfere with the oven spring of the dough. On the other hand the benefit of a Dutch oven is that you can make a really wet dough and if your Dutch oven is properly sized it can't spread out too much.

Have you ever tried any fridge aged, no knead recipes? They tend to yield really nice, thin and crisp crusts. They are not sourdoughs, as such, but because you can age them in your fridge for a week or more they do have a complex and slightly tangy flavour. These can be quite lovely loaves. I go through phases where I might bake no other breads for months on end.

Do you use any kind of dough conditioners? Sugar, milk, egg or any of those baker's conditioners will make your crumb more tender but will also hinder a thin , crisp crust. Having seen a couple of your loaves I am quite sure this isn't the problem, but feel I have to ask.

[Henry Krinkle]

Rules for a good Hawaiian; Fridge aged homemade dough, raw red onions, real smoked ham carved off the bone and fresh pineapple macerated in crushed chiles for at least a day.

[gnuyork]

Tough crusts can be an issue with sourdoughs. Maybe try something slightly fresher like your poolish or a biga plus the addition of a cup of dough reserved from a loaf you baked about a week ago. Have you done any old dough yet?


Oven temp can be a really big thing. I would get an accurate oven thermometer and find out what your oven's true temperature is. +-25 degrees is kind of the norm and it is not unheard of for ovens to be 50 degrees out.

Do you measure by weight or by volume. Flour is highly hygroscopic, so a change in humidity can give you wildy different results if you are measuring by volume. If you are close to the ocean or in a very humid area most recipes aren't designed for you. I have the opposite problem. I live in an extremely dry area and in winter measuring by weight can yield me a full cup less of flour than it does in summer.

Do you use any of the steam oven techniques? Ice cubes, spraying the oven, baking in a Dutch oven? My preferred method is a baking stone, I use a big heavy Pflatzgraff that we bought in the mid 90s, and a giant stainless steel bowl. The circumference of the bowl needs to be smaller than the circumference of the stone but big enough to not interfere with the oven spring of the dough. On the other hand the benefit of a Dutch oven is that you can make a really wet dough and if your Dutch oven is properly sized it can't spread out too much.

Have you ever tried any fridge aged, no knead recipes? They tend to yield really nice, thin and crisp crusts. They are not sourdoughs, as such, but because you can age them in your fridge for a week or more they do have a complex and slightly tangy flavour. These can be quite lovely loaves. I go through phases where I might bake no other breads for months on end.

Do you use any kind of dough conditioners? Sugar, milk, egg or any of those baker's conditioners will make your crumb more tender but will also hinder a thin , crisp crust. Having seen a couple of your loaves I am quite sure this isn't the problem, but feel I have to ask.

I measure by weight in grams and I use a baking steel, basically a 1/4 inch thick slab of steel for the bagels and baguettes (and pizza), and for the baguettes I do the water on a hot pan trick for steam. For my boule I do that in a dutch oven.

Also I have made a loaf or two of white bread with milk and butter, and those came out OK, and soft.

I use bread flour I got from Costco - got a big 50lb bag back in March - part of my pandemic planning - but it's bleached. I didn't learn about different flours until after I bought it. Next time I will go for unbleached.

I once did fridge aged baguettes, but they were kneaded and it was the same issue, but have not tried old dough yet.

I have been meaning to get an oven thermometer but always forget. I suspect my oven temp could be an issue, or my flour.

[Dan R]

I measure by weight in grams and I use a baking steel, basically a 1/4 inch thick slab of steel for the bagels and baguettes (and pizza), and for the baguettes I do the water on a hot pan trick for steam. For my boule I do that in a dutch oven.

Also I have made a loaf or two of white bread with milk and butter, and those came out OK, and soft.

I use bread flour I got from Costco - got a big 50lb bag back in March - part of my pandemic planning - but it's bleached. I didn't learn about different flours until after I bought it. Next time I will go for unbleached.

I once did fridge aged baguettes, but they were kneaded and it was the same issue, but have not tried old dough yet.

I have been meaning to get an oven thermometer but always forget. I suspect my oven temp could be an issue, or my flour.

I recall that adding steam if for crisping up crusts. If you add water and use a nat gas stove, that maybe to blame? Plenty of moist heat in a nat gas oven.

[Henry Krinkle]

I measure by weight in grams and I use a baking steel, basically a 1/4 inch thick slab of steel for the bagels and baguettes (and pizza), and for the baguettes I do the water on a hot pan trick for steam. For my boule I do that in a dutch oven.

Also I have made a loaf or two of white bread with milk and butter, and those came out OK, and soft.

I use bread flour I got from Costco - got a big 50lb bag back in March - part of my pandemic planning - but it's bleached. I didn't learn about different flours until after I bought it. Next time I will go for unbleached.

I once did fridge aged baguettes, but they were kneaded and it was the same issue, but have not tried old dough yet.

I have been meaning to get an oven thermometer but always forget. I suspect my oven temp could be an issue, or my flour.

Have you checked out any of the resources at places like King Arthur or the Flourist? A quick search at King Arthur yielded this page:

How to make crusty bread | King Arthur Baking

[gnuyork]

Have you checked out any of the resources at places like King Arthur or the Flourist? A quick search at King Arthur yielded this page:

How to make crusty bread | King Arthur Baking

Thanks, i'll check it out.

[Henry Krinkle]

Two decent no knead books. I have made recipes from both. I find that the five minutes a day bread tends to have thinner crispy crusts than Lahey's. It is also interesting to see how dough changes over days as the Five Minutes A Day recipes usually involve making four loaves worth at one go and then baking them on different days. One of my pizza doughs is based on Lahey's.

[geoffbot]

Homemade felafel and hummus (hidden underneath), pomegranate, dill, salady bits. V tasty.

[Dan R]

Two decent no knead books. I have made recipes from both. I find that the five minutes a day bread tends to have thinner crispy crusts than Lahey's. It is also interesting to see how dough changes over days as the Five Minutes A Day recipes usually involve making four loaves worth at one go and then baking them on different days. One of my pizza doughs is based on Lahey's.

That's rich. I am using the original Artisan Bread in Five Minutes book.

[gnuyork]

I did baguettes again today and they came out much better, but I think it's because I baked them for a little shorter time, and I used a bit less flour than last time.